They can be genetic dead ends all they like. Didn’t even post anything about jews there. Women will continue being trash as long as the internet controls them, and the genetic dead ends in mgtow can enjoy their death cult. Imagine thinking blacks are people just because it’s easier than controlling your women.
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ayowa on scored.co
1 year ago0 points(+0/-0)1 child
Let's tackle this. I want this to be in conversation with your comment. I call for more reproductive rights and family planning for men. That includes paternal leave and funding for single fathers. I also call for shared custody upon divorce. I don't see how that makes me part of a death cult as you say. This is very much about fighting for men to have more access to reproduction. Whatever article I click I find that I strongly call for more reproductive rights for men. I clicked this one --- [Exposing mainstream brainwashing with Andrew Tate and other Hoaxes they created throughout the years](https://communities.win/c/MGTOW/p/17sic2Ely4/exposing-mainstream-brainwashing/c) and even there I find stuff for giving men more power in having children.
MgtowMicah, you wouldn't believe this, but you sound like the feminists. We already talked about this before in [MGTOW and Redpill doesn't support men?](https://communities.win/c/MGTOW/p/17si5KOhm6/mgtow-and-redpill-doesnt-support/c). MGTOW not helping men is a tired subject now. Educate yourself on what the last 2 decades of MGTOW was like instead of assuming you are the most strongest and the greatest and all people fighting before you were bumbling fumbling morons. Mostly likely you are the bumbling retard if you think this way. Gently asking, please realize that this [MGTOW books](https://communities.win/c/MGTOW/p/17rSjDvsh6/mgtow-books/c) doesn't have 3 titles. It's a lengthy list. Probably more books than most people read in their lives.
You sound more like an MRA. MGTOW people tend to call it a "lifestyle choice," but they're pretty bad at deciding what they even are. MGTOW are pretty consistently anti-natalist though. I can't imagine them doing much of anything other than laughing at a "simp" in response to a man having an issue with a divorce, custody, or unwanted pregnancy. They tend to be anti-social spiteful mutant types.
As for the book list:
>Jewish MGTOW Guide: Jewish Men Going Torah Observant Ways in Marriage and Divorce by Menachem Ben David
I don't think that's going to help your case here.
I'll be as blunt with you as possible. The lack of transparency in MGTOW makes them come off as nefarious and up to no good while they are just men trying to find themselves in an age of heightened male disposability. So, I'll tell you everything as best as I understand them.
> You sound more like an MRA. MGTOW people tend to call it a "lifestyle choice," but they're pretty bad at deciding what they even are.
I know they have a hard time deciding on their life’s calling. But that's a personal matter; nobody is immune from it. MGTOW is a way of life about cutting the ties that link men to the feminine and aiding them chart their own authentic (masculine) path with the backing and support of a community of like-minded individuals; we focus on building group solidarity so that members feel empowered enough to say "No!" when the likes of cuck Jordan Peterson tells them marry even as the law emasculates them.
The MRA elements to MGTOW are still present for the mere fact we are striking against male disposability and gynocentrism (two things we consider political in nature since they pertain to laws and rules.)
The [MGTOW entry](https://wiki4men.com/wiki/Men_Going_Their_Own_Way) in Wiki4Men further clarifies the ties with the following: “A core tenet of MGTOW is rejection of gynocentrism, the preferential concern for women in both traditional and progressive forms” and “The proposition for political apartisanship, however, carries no moral authority for individual MGTOW who are free by definition to choose any political alignment they wish”; and finally, “MGTOW can be viewed as an economic weapon that operates in tandem with the Men's Rights Movement.”
On top of that, plenty of MRAs endorse the MGTOW philosophy and many of them are in fact MGTOW; so the separation between MGTOW and MRA is not so clearcut.
> MGTOW are pretty consistently anti-natalist though.
Concerning anti-natalism, they aren't majorly in support of any of that. MGTOW guys fetishize having kids and possessing a womb. This has been a consistent pattern in the community as this [search](https://communities.win/search?query=wombs&community=MGTOW) reveals the topic of artificial wombs never died for years, though if the search included comments it would have showed tons of other results. Sandman still focuses on neonatal technologies for giving men access to birthing kids, and Barbarossa suggested for a long time and in many podcasts men should use surrogacy to have kids instead. I never saw any other group in favor of these technologies as much as MGTOW. Even feminists fear such scenarios where men don’t need women anymore for reproduction.
So, the idea they are anti-natalist misses that they are anti-natalist with women only. Individually and away from women, they think they should have kids.
> I can't imagine them doing much of anything other than laughing at a "simp" in response to a man having an issue with a divorce, custody, or unwanted pregnancy. They tend to be anti-social spiteful mutant types.
I'm split between two reactions here. First, fuck them! Let them suffer! Whoever signs the gynocentric contract in these deeply feminist times is complicit in the destruction wrought upon millions of men. On the other hand, I apologize on behalf of other MGTOW for such attitudes. I have had to correct one MGTOW once because he was crashed by these false beliefs about “simping” in [Feeling a bit heavy](https://archive.is/WsuFC#selection-995.0-995.166). He was happier for it. But even then, we remain the most understanding compassionate group for men who are used and abused by the gynocentric system and the vindictive bitches.
The issue with MGTOW is larger than that though. ٍSome MGTOW guys were speculating as to why we are like this. Just take u/TheImpossible1 for instance and even u/DangZagnut. I’ve known these guys for over 5 years now — first, on Reddit and then GYOW forum, and then they are here on Scored expressing the same ideas I’ve always known them for believing. One argument is that there’s a biological disposition for MGTOW, the same way researchers found that autism creates disposition for Inceldom. In MGTOW, INTJ and INFJ is probably prevalent though only few sent me their result but I think nearly all of them have similar psychology.
> I don't think that's going to help your case here.
No, it does. OP said that MGTOW is a death cult — they are ending their genetic line and letting other races especially Jews takeover. He also says that we are in the business of producing sufficient levels of apathy in white people to allow the debauchery to go on and destroy more lives. If MGTOW is a Jewish ploy to weaken us, why then would they use it on themselves? If Jews are participating in MGTOW, and urging other Torah observers to join in, that's your rebuttal for all these accusations.
Jordan Petersen is an Israel shill who works for the Daily Wire. Everything else he is doing is in service to that. You'd probably get banned for discussing that on c/MGTOW though, even without a track record of posting here.
Those artificial womb threads don't seem to have any pro-natalism in them. There were some guys saying they didn't want kids though. Most of the discussion centered around power dynamics with nothing much at all said about the need for family.
>Whoever signs the gynocentric contract in these deeply feminist times is complicit in the destruction wrought upon millions of men
Marriages are getting better for men, not worse. The divorce rate peaked in the 70s or 80s. Men are paying less alimony and are getting better custody arrangements and so forth than we used to. It still favors women but actually by less now than it used to.
>Just take u/TheImpossible1 for instance and even u/DangZagnut. I’ve known these guys for over 5 years now — first, on Reddit and then GYOW forum, and then they are here on Scored expressing the same ideas I’ve always known them for believing.
I've known TheImp for a while. His lecturing everyone else about racism while calling for racial genocide against Palestinians is a recent development. I only vaguely remember Dang from reddit.
>He also says that we are in the business of producing sufficient levels of apathy in white people to allow the debauchery to go on and destroy more lives. If MGTOW is a Jewish ploy to weaken us, why then would they use it on themselves?
This is from the book's Amazon description, "Jewish MGTOW refers to Jewish Men Going Torah Observant Ways in marriage, family, and divorce.Jewish MGTOW recognizes the importance of marriage and relationships with women, unlike secular MGTOW.Jewish MGTOW rejects feminism and the gender hatred and gender wars feminism promotes."
In other words, it's a pro-natalist, pro-family book, nothing like the anti-natalist hedonism and seething hatred of women you'll find on MGTOW here.
Even though men pay less in alimony that burden shifted to child support. Child support increased to compensate for alimony. Add to that, other forms of extortion rose up such as affirmative action, welfare and quota hiring. That's on top of old social extortion such as making the men pay for everything. That's where you find divorces decreasing and not increasing. Women take away money from men without needing to marry and then divorce them.
But this still misses the point. The old adage in MGTOW is that men do not fear marriage, they fear divorce. We are against one-sided laws that ransack men. We argue for this ardently to the point we call divorcing men a form of rape. (Rape has the other definition of taking away something by force leaving the victim undignified; so it's not just us being edgy.)
So, I agree with you that MGTOW gets entangled in "seething hatred of women". They should know that the problem is in fact the system. Specifically democracy as it allows people to conquer institutions and laws by numbers. Female voters have outnumbered male voters since 1982 to be specific.
> I've known TheImp for a while. His lecturing everyone else about racism while calling for racial genocide against Palestinians is a recent development. I only vaguely remember Dang from reddit.
He's a retard. I'm imagining him to be an extremely obese neckbeard type of guy. He has hundreds of thousands of points.
I don't know why that Jewish book makes a distinction between Secular MGTOW and religious MGTOW. I think the distinction exists only in vernacular. I don't think they have ever formally divided members of the group in that manner.
His statements are rather evident in MGTOW circles. Yes, marriage and relationships with women are important. In fact, that's where the problem all begins. Patriarchy was definitely a reproductive strategy and not a social organization of men ruling over women. Patriarchy had tons and tons of times ruled in favor of women at the expense of men. Gynocentrism though is a social organization. He adds, "Jewish MGTOW rejects feminism and the gender hatred and gender wars feminism promotes." All of MGTOW does that. That's not unique to some Jewish MGTOWism.
To seal the deal, here's the plan from the [MGTOW manifesto](http://no-maam.blogspot.com/2001/02/mgtow-manifesto.html) that was published in 2001:
> The goal is to instill masculinity in men, femininity in women, and work toward limited government!
>
> By instilling masculinity in men, we make men self-reliant, proud, and independent.
>
> By instilling femininity in women, we make them nurturing, supporting, and responsible.
>
> By working for a limited government, we are working for freedom and justice.
>
> Women having "other qualities" is not interesting to men because we don't need them! Femininity will be the price women pay for enjoying masculinity in men!
>
> This is the aim of "Men Going Their Own Way".
We still fervently fight for that. Less government, more masculine men, and more feminine women, please! Enough of the woke feminist crap. That's still the message.
I haven't seen anything to indicate that child support is going up.
Affirmative action also isn't anything new. It's just more visible with modern culture churning out girl power sludge. If you look at where affirmative action has been most prolific, in colleges, it's not even that beneficial anymore. The value of degrees is going down while the cost is going up. This is especially true for the career fields women gravitate toward. Men can also marry women who work, even ones who are affirmative action hires.
> Specifically democracy as it allows people to conquer institutions and laws by numbers.
This kind of thinking is a problem with MGTOW types. You guys see a teeming mass of women as your biggest problem and are allergic to being critical of elites. They impose unpopular policies on the public all the time. Politics are elite driven.
>He's a retard. I'm imagining him to be an extremely obese neckbeard type of guy. He has hundreds of thousands of points.
That's dismissive. He's a genocidal Zionist who is only finger-wagging at MGTOW over racism for his own racial interest. He loves Israel, an extremely racist and "tradcucked" country, one of the worst in the world.
>MGTOW manifesto
You will be called a simp for posting that on MGTOW here. The users there trend more towards the "women are evil subhumans" world view.
MgtowMicah, you wouldn't believe this, but you sound like the feminists. We already talked about this before in [MGTOW and Redpill doesn't support men?](https://communities.win/c/MGTOW/p/17si5KOhm6/mgtow-and-redpill-doesnt-support/c). MGTOW not helping men is a tired subject now. Educate yourself on what the last 2 decades of MGTOW was like instead of assuming you are the most strongest and the greatest and all people fighting before you were bumbling fumbling morons. Mostly likely you are the bumbling retard if you think this way. Gently asking, please realize that this [MGTOW books](https://communities.win/c/MGTOW/p/17rSjDvsh6/mgtow-books/c) doesn't have 3 titles. It's a lengthy list. Probably more books than most people read in their lives.
As for the book list:
>Jewish MGTOW Guide: Jewish Men Going Torah Observant Ways in Marriage and Divorce by Menachem Ben David
I don't think that's going to help your case here.
> You sound more like an MRA. MGTOW people tend to call it a "lifestyle choice," but they're pretty bad at deciding what they even are.
I know they have a hard time deciding on their life’s calling. But that's a personal matter; nobody is immune from it. MGTOW is a way of life about cutting the ties that link men to the feminine and aiding them chart their own authentic (masculine) path with the backing and support of a community of like-minded individuals; we focus on building group solidarity so that members feel empowered enough to say "No!" when the likes of cuck Jordan Peterson tells them marry even as the law emasculates them.
The MRA elements to MGTOW are still present for the mere fact we are striking against male disposability and gynocentrism (two things we consider political in nature since they pertain to laws and rules.)
The [MGTOW entry](https://wiki4men.com/wiki/Men_Going_Their_Own_Way) in Wiki4Men further clarifies the ties with the following: “A core tenet of MGTOW is rejection of gynocentrism, the preferential concern for women in both traditional and progressive forms” and “The proposition for political apartisanship, however, carries no moral authority for individual MGTOW who are free by definition to choose any political alignment they wish”; and finally, “MGTOW can be viewed as an economic weapon that operates in tandem with the Men's Rights Movement.”
On top of that, plenty of MRAs endorse the MGTOW philosophy and many of them are in fact MGTOW; so the separation between MGTOW and MRA is not so clearcut.
> MGTOW are pretty consistently anti-natalist though.
Concerning anti-natalism, they aren't majorly in support of any of that. MGTOW guys fetishize having kids and possessing a womb. This has been a consistent pattern in the community as this [search](https://communities.win/search?query=wombs&community=MGTOW) reveals the topic of artificial wombs never died for years, though if the search included comments it would have showed tons of other results. Sandman still focuses on neonatal technologies for giving men access to birthing kids, and Barbarossa suggested for a long time and in many podcasts men should use surrogacy to have kids instead. I never saw any other group in favor of these technologies as much as MGTOW. Even feminists fear such scenarios where men don’t need women anymore for reproduction.
So, the idea they are anti-natalist misses that they are anti-natalist with women only. Individually and away from women, they think they should have kids.
> I can't imagine them doing much of anything other than laughing at a "simp" in response to a man having an issue with a divorce, custody, or unwanted pregnancy. They tend to be anti-social spiteful mutant types.
I'm split between two reactions here. First, fuck them! Let them suffer! Whoever signs the gynocentric contract in these deeply feminist times is complicit in the destruction wrought upon millions of men. On the other hand, I apologize on behalf of other MGTOW for such attitudes. I have had to correct one MGTOW once because he was crashed by these false beliefs about “simping” in [Feeling a bit heavy](https://archive.is/WsuFC#selection-995.0-995.166). He was happier for it. But even then, we remain the most understanding compassionate group for men who are used and abused by the gynocentric system and the vindictive bitches.
The issue with MGTOW is larger than that though. ٍSome MGTOW guys were speculating as to why we are like this. Just take u/TheImpossible1 for instance and even u/DangZagnut. I’ve known these guys for over 5 years now — first, on Reddit and then GYOW forum, and then they are here on Scored expressing the same ideas I’ve always known them for believing. One argument is that there’s a biological disposition for MGTOW, the same way researchers found that autism creates disposition for Inceldom. In MGTOW, INTJ and INFJ is probably prevalent though only few sent me their result but I think nearly all of them have similar psychology.
> I don't think that's going to help your case here.
No, it does. OP said that MGTOW is a death cult — they are ending their genetic line and letting other races especially Jews takeover. He also says that we are in the business of producing sufficient levels of apathy in white people to allow the debauchery to go on and destroy more lives. If MGTOW is a Jewish ploy to weaken us, why then would they use it on themselves? If Jews are participating in MGTOW, and urging other Torah observers to join in, that's your rebuttal for all these accusations.
Those artificial womb threads don't seem to have any pro-natalism in them. There were some guys saying they didn't want kids though. Most of the discussion centered around power dynamics with nothing much at all said about the need for family.
>Whoever signs the gynocentric contract in these deeply feminist times is complicit in the destruction wrought upon millions of men
Marriages are getting better for men, not worse. The divorce rate peaked in the 70s or 80s. Men are paying less alimony and are getting better custody arrangements and so forth than we used to. It still favors women but actually by less now than it used to.
>Just take u/TheImpossible1 for instance and even u/DangZagnut. I’ve known these guys for over 5 years now — first, on Reddit and then GYOW forum, and then they are here on Scored expressing the same ideas I’ve always known them for believing.
I've known TheImp for a while. His lecturing everyone else about racism while calling for racial genocide against Palestinians is a recent development. I only vaguely remember Dang from reddit.
>He also says that we are in the business of producing sufficient levels of apathy in white people to allow the debauchery to go on and destroy more lives. If MGTOW is a Jewish ploy to weaken us, why then would they use it on themselves?
This is from the book's Amazon description, "Jewish MGTOW refers to Jewish Men Going Torah Observant Ways in marriage, family, and divorce.Jewish MGTOW recognizes the importance of marriage and relationships with women, unlike secular MGTOW.Jewish MGTOW rejects feminism and the gender hatred and gender wars feminism promotes."
In other words, it's a pro-natalist, pro-family book, nothing like the anti-natalist hedonism and seething hatred of women you'll find on MGTOW here.
But this still misses the point. The old adage in MGTOW is that men do not fear marriage, they fear divorce. We are against one-sided laws that ransack men. We argue for this ardently to the point we call divorcing men a form of rape. (Rape has the other definition of taking away something by force leaving the victim undignified; so it's not just us being edgy.)
So, I agree with you that MGTOW gets entangled in "seething hatred of women". They should know that the problem is in fact the system. Specifically democracy as it allows people to conquer institutions and laws by numbers. Female voters have outnumbered male voters since 1982 to be specific.
> I've known TheImp for a while. His lecturing everyone else about racism while calling for racial genocide against Palestinians is a recent development. I only vaguely remember Dang from reddit.
He's a retard. I'm imagining him to be an extremely obese neckbeard type of guy. He has hundreds of thousands of points.
I don't know why that Jewish book makes a distinction between Secular MGTOW and religious MGTOW. I think the distinction exists only in vernacular. I don't think they have ever formally divided members of the group in that manner.
His statements are rather evident in MGTOW circles. Yes, marriage and relationships with women are important. In fact, that's where the problem all begins. Patriarchy was definitely a reproductive strategy and not a social organization of men ruling over women. Patriarchy had tons and tons of times ruled in favor of women at the expense of men. Gynocentrism though is a social organization. He adds, "Jewish MGTOW rejects feminism and the gender hatred and gender wars feminism promotes." All of MGTOW does that. That's not unique to some Jewish MGTOWism.
To seal the deal, here's the plan from the [MGTOW manifesto](http://no-maam.blogspot.com/2001/02/mgtow-manifesto.html) that was published in 2001:
> The goal is to instill masculinity in men, femininity in women, and work toward limited government!
>
> By instilling masculinity in men, we make men self-reliant, proud, and independent.
>
> By instilling femininity in women, we make them nurturing, supporting, and responsible.
>
> By working for a limited government, we are working for freedom and justice.
>
> Women having "other qualities" is not interesting to men because we don't need them! Femininity will be the price women pay for enjoying masculinity in men!
>
> This is the aim of "Men Going Their Own Way".
We still fervently fight for that. Less government, more masculine men, and more feminine women, please! Enough of the woke feminist crap. That's still the message.
Affirmative action also isn't anything new. It's just more visible with modern culture churning out girl power sludge. If you look at where affirmative action has been most prolific, in colleges, it's not even that beneficial anymore. The value of degrees is going down while the cost is going up. This is especially true for the career fields women gravitate toward. Men can also marry women who work, even ones who are affirmative action hires.
> Specifically democracy as it allows people to conquer institutions and laws by numbers.
This kind of thinking is a problem with MGTOW types. You guys see a teeming mass of women as your biggest problem and are allergic to being critical of elites. They impose unpopular policies on the public all the time. Politics are elite driven.
>He's a retard. I'm imagining him to be an extremely obese neckbeard type of guy. He has hundreds of thousands of points.
That's dismissive. He's a genocidal Zionist who is only finger-wagging at MGTOW over racism for his own racial interest. He loves Israel, an extremely racist and "tradcucked" country, one of the worst in the world.
>MGTOW manifesto
You will be called a simp for posting that on MGTOW here. The users there trend more towards the "women are evil subhumans" world view.