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31
posted 1 year ago by GoldenInnosStatue on scored.co (+0 / -0 / +31Score on mirror )
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15 comments:
devotech2 on scored.co
1 year ago 6 points (+0 / -0 / +6Score on mirror ) 2 children
German naval doctrine was tragically not very good.

The kriegsmarine had pretty atrocious destroyers, they dumped too many resources into unwieldy and outdated surface ships (Tirpitz, Bismarck, looking at you specifically)

If the Graf zeppelin and other carriers could actually have been completed, their destroyers weren't shit, and/or more type vii u boats were built before the war, Britain would have had its shipping absolutely decimated. But they prioritized the wrong shit.

It was actually very good for a completely unprepared navy (which it was, 6 years is not sufficient to build an entire fleet), but it could have been better if they allocated their resources better. And had destroyers that weren't shit tier, and better doctrine (but comparing their naval doctrine to the US, UK, and Japan is not entirely fair because those 3 countries are entirely built upon sea power, germany barely had a navy until shortly before ww1 and the traditional german naval doctrine was just "its a waste of time").
Captain_Raamsley on scored.co
1 year ago 3 points (+0 / -0 / +3Score on mirror )
Germany should have gone for a sub only strat like I do every time I play hoi4. It's the meta.
Serathis on scored.co
1 year ago 0 points (+0 / -0 ) 1 child
Some say their navy was made against the SU not the UK, then surface ships would have made sense. But it was a huge mistake not prepping contingency against the UK. The whole naval command structure was a giant clusterfuck. No coordination with the air force. Sending unescorted capital ships as raiders. And more.
devotech2 on scored.co
1 year ago 1 point (+0 / -0 / +1Score on mirror ) 2 children
Well, the main type of ship used for eliminating submarines (which the ussr also had a submarine heavy navy) is a destroyer. The kriegsmarine had possibly the worst destroyer fleet of any major player during the entire war. Their destroyers were truly a joke. And they lost half of them, at the very beginning of the war.

The Graf zeppelin was also one of the biggest fuckups of naval history, and airpower makes combating submarines a lot easier, so mothballing it eternally for a planned naval war with the ussr in favor of the dumbass tirpitz and Bismarck was a stupid move.
Serathis on scored.co
1 year ago 1 point (+0 / -0 / +1Score on mirror ) 2 children
I'm not sure if the Kreigsmarine had problems with subs attacking them. And no one foresee air power being such a great factor in the war. Still they made plenty of mistakes. Both on the strategic and tactical level.
Taken_BY_the_Wind on scored.co
1 year ago 0 points (+0 / -0 )
Hello good brother. The writing was on the wall prewar that air power would be the deciding factor for naval strategy. There was a famous exercise off the west coast involving the American fleet in the 30's. One admiral who's name eludes me, used a carrier to great effect. The Brits were also coming to this conclusion. The Japanese were certainly not behind the times either. I can not recall specific details so my assessment may be incorrect.

May your life be blessed dear brother, and may your family enjoy good health until the world stops turning.
devotech2 on scored.co
1 year ago 0 points (+0 / -0 )
Japan and the royal navy both realized that air power was gonna be a huge game changer by the 1920s and the gamble paid off immensely for both of them. The amount of tunnel vision to not see what the 2 most dominant navies in the world were doing is kind of wild. Even the Yamato and Musashi, which seem stupid, were built to actually counter a numerically superior fleet by building the most powerful warship... ever. And it was largely due to lack of resources, and the Yamato actually sank some pretty high value ships. The Bismarck and tirpitz were just... a big waste of time really, there wasn't any reason to build them. Germany had plenty of resources. Yeah the Bismarck sank an ancient battleship that was probably a year away from a scrap yard, big deal. It was sank by a relic of a plane.

As to kriegsmarine losses to submarines, the royal navy did not invest much into underwater warfare. Kind of their own failure, but they were still undeniably superior to the kreigsmarine and had no issue destroying the wolf packs whenever the shock and awe aspect dissipated. In large part due to *air power*.

If the kriegsmarine actually did much with the red fleet beyond skirmishes, they would probably have had quite a few losses to submarines, because the soviets also had a submarine fleet. But this didn't really come to fruition. But the soviets actually *did* inflict the worst maritime loss in human history (counting every other accident civilian or otherwise) by sinking the Wilhelm Gustlof with a submarine, this was more of a one off. The baltic sea campaigns didn't amount to much besides a bunch of defensive posturing, the most notable battle was the battle of narvik, which was objectively humiliating for the kriegsmarine.

Japan carried the entire axis on its back in regards to naval warfare. If Japan were neutral and the other half of the royal navy and the entire US navy didn't have their hands tied dealing with the beast that was the IJN, it would have been over for the kriegsmarine before it even began. Germany 100% had it with their army, but as I said, without Japan turning the royal navy into a coral reef and perpetually stalling the US navy, the kriegsmarine would have been pretty effortlessly ensnared. There is actually a very good reason why hitler chose japan as an ally, they were far from being a liability which is pop culture bullshit history. Hitler knew that the kriegsmarine was a dumpster fire.
Taken_BY_the_Wind on scored.co
1 year ago 0 points (+0 / -0 ) 1 child
Greetings, naval history enjoying brother,

You're correct on many accounts. Have you ever heard of the Hilfskreuzer class? They saw some excellent successes as surface ships, but were modified from civilian vessels.

I hope for all your days to be prosperous, good brother.

devotech2 on scored.co
1 year ago 0 points (+0 / -0 ) 1 child
I am a marine engineer, so I do know quite a bit by proxy. I've spent a lot of time actually at sea. It's something that interests me quite a bit.

I've heard of the hilfskreuzer class. See, the kriegsmarine actually excelled in essentially "naval guerilla warfare", because it was inferior. The reason why the kriegsmarine overall sucked was because they tried to use traditional naval doctrine with an inferior fleet. When they shone, they did it well, but when they didn't, it was disastrously bad. If I remember correctly, there was also a lot of admiral infighting in the German navy, which probably contributed to this significantly.
Taken_BY_the_Wind on scored.co
1 year ago 0 points (+0 / -0 ) 1 child
Ah very good, sea faring brother. I have dreamt of a life at sea since I was a boy. Alas, it is not in the cards.

There was one instance in the hilfskreuzer episodes where they played the part too well. An allied plane appeared on the horizon and the Germans got to work, pretending to be your typical deck crew. They were so invested in appearing inconspicuous, not one of them acknowledged the plane at all. Usually there would be antics and waving but the apathetic nature of those on deck was strange enough that the plane called in a warship.

There is a man on youtube who makes videos that the soyim would consider boring, named Drachinifel. He talks about ww2 naval and age of sail topics without music in the background or wacky video editing. Very dry and informational. You may find his videos interesting. I certainly do.

May your career be fruitful, sea faring brother.
WTFisThisShit on scored.co
1 year ago 5 points (+0 / -0 / +5Score on mirror )
That would look awesome above my fireplace.
PraiseBeToScience on scored.co
1 year ago 2 points (+0 / -0 / +2Score on mirror ) 1 child
Funny how the international prohibition on salvaging/desecrating war graves magically doesn't matter now. They're almost certainly going to melt that down and probably cast some nigger atrocity out of it.
Serathis on scored.co
1 year ago 2 points (+0 / -0 / +2Score on mirror )
The ship was scuttled near the dock, after evacuation. There are no dead bodies.
deleted 1 year ago 1 point (+0 / -0 / +1Score on mirror )
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