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Serathis on scored.co
1 year ago0 points(+0/-0)1 child
Some say their navy was made against the SU not the UK, then surface ships would have made sense. But it was a huge mistake not prepping contingency against the UK. The whole naval command structure was a giant clusterfuck. No coordination with the air force. Sending unescorted capital ships as raiders. And more.
1 year ago1 point(+0/-0/+1Score on mirror)2 children
Well, the main type of ship used for eliminating submarines (which the ussr also had a submarine heavy navy) is a destroyer. The kriegsmarine had possibly the worst destroyer fleet of any major player during the entire war. Their destroyers were truly a joke. And they lost half of them, at the very beginning of the war.
The Graf zeppelin was also one of the biggest fuckups of naval history, and airpower makes combating submarines a lot easier, so mothballing it eternally for a planned naval war with the ussr in favor of the dumbass tirpitz and Bismarck was a stupid move.
1 year ago1 point(+0/-0/+1Score on mirror)2 children
I'm not sure if the Kreigsmarine had problems with subs attacking them. And no one foresee air power being such a great factor in the war. Still they made plenty of mistakes. Both on the strategic and tactical level.
Hello good brother. The writing was on the wall prewar that air power would be the deciding factor for naval strategy. There was a famous exercise off the west coast involving the American fleet in the 30's. One admiral who's name eludes me, used a carrier to great effect. The Brits were also coming to this conclusion. The Japanese were certainly not behind the times either. I can not recall specific details so my assessment may be incorrect.
May your life be blessed dear brother, and may your family enjoy good health until the world stops turning.
Japan and the royal navy both realized that air power was gonna be a huge game changer by the 1920s and the gamble paid off immensely for both of them. The amount of tunnel vision to not see what the 2 most dominant navies in the world were doing is kind of wild. Even the Yamato and Musashi, which seem stupid, were built to actually counter a numerically superior fleet by building the most powerful warship... ever. And it was largely due to lack of resources, and the Yamato actually sank some pretty high value ships. The Bismarck and tirpitz were just... a big waste of time really, there wasn't any reason to build them. Germany had plenty of resources. Yeah the Bismarck sank an ancient battleship that was probably a year away from a scrap yard, big deal. It was sank by a relic of a plane.
As to kriegsmarine losses to submarines, the royal navy did not invest much into underwater warfare. Kind of their own failure, but they were still undeniably superior to the kreigsmarine and had no issue destroying the wolf packs whenever the shock and awe aspect dissipated. In large part due to *air power*.
If the kriegsmarine actually did much with the red fleet beyond skirmishes, they would probably have had quite a few losses to submarines, because the soviets also had a submarine fleet. But this didn't really come to fruition. But the soviets actually *did* inflict the worst maritime loss in human history (counting every other accident civilian or otherwise) by sinking the Wilhelm Gustlof with a submarine, this was more of a one off. The baltic sea campaigns didn't amount to much besides a bunch of defensive posturing, the most notable battle was the battle of narvik, which was objectively humiliating for the kriegsmarine.
Japan carried the entire axis on its back in regards to naval warfare. If Japan were neutral and the other half of the royal navy and the entire US navy didn't have their hands tied dealing with the beast that was the IJN, it would have been over for the kriegsmarine before it even began. Germany 100% had it with their army, but as I said, without Japan turning the royal navy into a coral reef and perpetually stalling the US navy, the kriegsmarine would have been pretty effortlessly ensnared. There is actually a very good reason why hitler chose japan as an ally, they were far from being a liability which is pop culture bullshit history. Hitler knew that the kriegsmarine was a dumpster fire.
You're correct on many accounts. Have you ever heard of the Hilfskreuzer class? They saw some excellent successes as surface ships, but were modified from civilian vessels.
I hope for all your days to be prosperous, good brother.
I am a marine engineer, so I do know quite a bit by proxy. I've spent a lot of time actually at sea. It's something that interests me quite a bit.
I've heard of the hilfskreuzer class. See, the kriegsmarine actually excelled in essentially "naval guerilla warfare", because it was inferior. The reason why the kriegsmarine overall sucked was because they tried to use traditional naval doctrine with an inferior fleet. When they shone, they did it well, but when they didn't, it was disastrously bad. If I remember correctly, there was also a lot of admiral infighting in the German navy, which probably contributed to this significantly.
Ah very good, sea faring brother. I have dreamt of a life at sea since I was a boy. Alas, it is not in the cards.
There was one instance in the hilfskreuzer episodes where they played the part too well. An allied plane appeared on the horizon and the Germans got to work, pretending to be your typical deck crew. They were so invested in appearing inconspicuous, not one of them acknowledged the plane at all. Usually there would be antics and waving but the apathetic nature of those on deck was strange enough that the plane called in a warship.
There is a man on youtube who makes videos that the soyim would consider boring, named Drachinifel. He talks about ww2 naval and age of sail topics without music in the background or wacky video editing. Very dry and informational. You may find his videos interesting. I certainly do.
Another very glossed over fact of history is the absolute suckerpunch that the confederate navy delivered to the US navy.
Before the Civil War, the US navy was underequipped and underfunded. General American consensus was that a navy was a waste of time, the navy was also the only branch of the military that had constitutionally mandated limits to its power. Most infamously, the highest rank one could attain in the US navy was captain (o-6), which is 4 ranks behind the maximum in the army and marines.
This all changed with the Civil War, because the confederacy put a huge emphasis on a powerful blue water navy and learned from the royal navy on doctrine and shipbuilding. Confederate ships were sinking union commerce vessels and warships like fish in a barrel. It was one of the most humiliating chapters of American naval history. The confederacy also had a fully functioning admiralty before the USN did.
This kick to the chest was why Theodore Roosevelt made the USN a powerful force. His uncle was an officer on the CSS Alabama, an absolute beast of a ship that had one of the highest kill ratios in the history of any navy ever. Possibly the highest of any surface ship in history. Without the confederacy and its naval advancements, the USN would be a bunch of river patrol boats and barely seaworthy littoral vessels to this day.
Thought i would share some interesting information. Fair winds and following seas brother. Life at sea is difficult, sleep is a luxury, working is the norm. Surrounded by an environment that tries everything it can do to kill you, protected by steel hulls and whirring engines. Between work and watch there's hardly a moment to yourself. But it's worth it, it's among the most aryan of jobs. The beauty of the ocean is unparalleled but should be taken in along with a healthy sense of respect that the only thing keeping you alive is the structural integrity of your vessel.
The Graf zeppelin was also one of the biggest fuckups of naval history, and airpower makes combating submarines a lot easier, so mothballing it eternally for a planned naval war with the ussr in favor of the dumbass tirpitz and Bismarck was a stupid move.
May your life be blessed dear brother, and may your family enjoy good health until the world stops turning.
As to kriegsmarine losses to submarines, the royal navy did not invest much into underwater warfare. Kind of their own failure, but they were still undeniably superior to the kreigsmarine and had no issue destroying the wolf packs whenever the shock and awe aspect dissipated. In large part due to *air power*.
If the kriegsmarine actually did much with the red fleet beyond skirmishes, they would probably have had quite a few losses to submarines, because the soviets also had a submarine fleet. But this didn't really come to fruition. But the soviets actually *did* inflict the worst maritime loss in human history (counting every other accident civilian or otherwise) by sinking the Wilhelm Gustlof with a submarine, this was more of a one off. The baltic sea campaigns didn't amount to much besides a bunch of defensive posturing, the most notable battle was the battle of narvik, which was objectively humiliating for the kriegsmarine.
Japan carried the entire axis on its back in regards to naval warfare. If Japan were neutral and the other half of the royal navy and the entire US navy didn't have their hands tied dealing with the beast that was the IJN, it would have been over for the kriegsmarine before it even began. Germany 100% had it with their army, but as I said, without Japan turning the royal navy into a coral reef and perpetually stalling the US navy, the kriegsmarine would have been pretty effortlessly ensnared. There is actually a very good reason why hitler chose japan as an ally, they were far from being a liability which is pop culture bullshit history. Hitler knew that the kriegsmarine was a dumpster fire.
You're correct on many accounts. Have you ever heard of the Hilfskreuzer class? They saw some excellent successes as surface ships, but were modified from civilian vessels.
I hope for all your days to be prosperous, good brother.
I've heard of the hilfskreuzer class. See, the kriegsmarine actually excelled in essentially "naval guerilla warfare", because it was inferior. The reason why the kriegsmarine overall sucked was because they tried to use traditional naval doctrine with an inferior fleet. When they shone, they did it well, but when they didn't, it was disastrously bad. If I remember correctly, there was also a lot of admiral infighting in the German navy, which probably contributed to this significantly.
There was one instance in the hilfskreuzer episodes where they played the part too well. An allied plane appeared on the horizon and the Germans got to work, pretending to be your typical deck crew. They were so invested in appearing inconspicuous, not one of them acknowledged the plane at all. Usually there would be antics and waving but the apathetic nature of those on deck was strange enough that the plane called in a warship.
There is a man on youtube who makes videos that the soyim would consider boring, named Drachinifel. He talks about ww2 naval and age of sail topics without music in the background or wacky video editing. Very dry and informational. You may find his videos interesting. I certainly do.
May your career be fruitful, sea faring brother.
Before the Civil War, the US navy was underequipped and underfunded. General American consensus was that a navy was a waste of time, the navy was also the only branch of the military that had constitutionally mandated limits to its power. Most infamously, the highest rank one could attain in the US navy was captain (o-6), which is 4 ranks behind the maximum in the army and marines.
This all changed with the Civil War, because the confederacy put a huge emphasis on a powerful blue water navy and learned from the royal navy on doctrine and shipbuilding. Confederate ships were sinking union commerce vessels and warships like fish in a barrel. It was one of the most humiliating chapters of American naval history. The confederacy also had a fully functioning admiralty before the USN did.
This kick to the chest was why Theodore Roosevelt made the USN a powerful force. His uncle was an officer on the CSS Alabama, an absolute beast of a ship that had one of the highest kill ratios in the history of any navy ever. Possibly the highest of any surface ship in history. Without the confederacy and its naval advancements, the USN would be a bunch of river patrol boats and barely seaworthy littoral vessels to this day.
Thought i would share some interesting information. Fair winds and following seas brother. Life at sea is difficult, sleep is a luxury, working is the norm. Surrounded by an environment that tries everything it can do to kill you, protected by steel hulls and whirring engines. Between work and watch there's hardly a moment to yourself. But it's worth it, it's among the most aryan of jobs. The beauty of the ocean is unparalleled but should be taken in along with a healthy sense of respect that the only thing keeping you alive is the structural integrity of your vessel.