My uncle, whom i work with, refuses to speak to me or even be in the same room as me all just because I was reading the glr classic book "White Power". I guess he got triggered by the title and swastikas on the cover. Fucking ridiculous, how you gonna stay mad at someone for reading a book ?
You are viewing a single comment's thread. View all
1
ApexVeritas on scored.co
1 year ago1 point(+0/-0/+1Score on mirror)1 child
Your interpretation of that passage is false.
For reference: Luke 14:26:
> “If any man come to Me and hate not his father and mother, and wife and children, and brethren and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple."
If God commanded us to wholly separate ourselves from and hate our family, He wouldn't have also told us:
Ephesians 6:2-3:
> “Honor your father and mother, as the Lord your God has commanded you, so that you may live long and prosper in the land the Lord your God is giving you.”
Exodus 20:12:
> “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be prolonged in the land which the Lord your God gives you.”
Proverbs 1:8-9:
> “Listen, my son, to your father’s instruction and do not forsake your mother’s teaching. They will be a garland to grace your head and a pendant for your neck.”
Thus, Jesus must be meaning something else. In the original Greek, "hate" is translated from "miseo", which can mean hate, but also "reject".
Humans are imperfect, finite, mortal creatures. God (and Jesus) are perfect, infinite, and immortal. In order for us to follow God/Jesus, we must reject our imperfections.
Is this not how good people, in general, are morally obligated to act? If our family members fall to falsehoods and lies, we're obligated to stand firm in truth, and to not fall victim to our own family's faults, no matter how much we may love them. This is the correct interpretation of that passage. We're not supposed to fully reject and hate our family, only to prioritize truth (God) above our family. That's the proper order of things, whether you're a Christian or not.
There is nothing to "interpret". That passage says what it says. The passages that you brought as counterargument were not the words of Jesus Christ, none of them. In a different passage Jesus says that he brings war between family members.
So he tells us to love strangers and enemies, and he tells us to hate and go to war against our family members!
> We're not supposed to fully reject and hate our family, only to prioritize truth (God) above our family.
Yes I understand that this is the point. You're not supposed to hate your family only because they are your family, but you are supposed to put loving God above loving your own family.
And this is *exactly* what I said in my previous post. It breaks down the bonds of blood, because now there is something more important than your own blood; there's a rabbi that you need to love more than your own children.
Note how it doesn't say that you need to love God more than you love your neighbor; Jesus attacks the love for your family and promotes the love for strangers, hence eliminating the special bond that you should have with your kin.
> prioritize truth (God) above our family. That's the proper order of things, whether you're a Christian or not.
This is not the proper order of things. This is the order of things of a psychotic schizophrenic. Abraham heard voices in his head and tried to murder his own son. And you don't think this sounds crazy?
Would you murder your own family if you think you've heard the voice of god commanding you to do so?
> There is nothing to "interpret". That passage says what it says.
If the passage merely "says what it says", it wouldn't be contradicted in other passages of the Bible, or be contradicted by common logic. Thus, the message is not what you're claiming.
Plenty of passages are contradicted by common logic and by other passages.
Anyway, did you miss the part where I agreed with you?
Yes the passage meaning is that you should put God above your family. This is what I have an issue with.
You said:
> If our family members fall to falsehoods and lies, we're obligated to stand firm in truth, and to not all victim to our own family's faults, no matter how much we may love them. This is the correct interpretation of that passage. We're not supposed to fully reject and hate our family, only to prioritize truth (God) above our family.
Let me ask you something, as a thought experiment.
Imagine you have a 20 years old son who comes home from a night out and he's very upset, crying and scared, and he tells you that he forced himself on a girl. He doesn't know what got into him, but he raped this girl.
Would you:
1) Convince him to turn himself in, and if he doesn't, report him to the authorities.
2) Ask what kind of evidences the girl may have against him, and think about how to provide him with an alibi.
For reference: Luke 14:26:
> “If any man come to Me and hate not his father and mother, and wife and children, and brethren and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple."
If God commanded us to wholly separate ourselves from and hate our family, He wouldn't have also told us:
Ephesians 6:2-3:
> “Honor your father and mother, as the Lord your God has commanded you, so that you may live long and prosper in the land the Lord your God is giving you.”
Exodus 20:12:
> “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be prolonged in the land which the Lord your God gives you.”
Proverbs 1:8-9:
> “Listen, my son, to your father’s instruction and do not forsake your mother’s teaching. They will be a garland to grace your head and a pendant for your neck.”
Thus, Jesus must be meaning something else. In the original Greek, "hate" is translated from "miseo", which can mean hate, but also "reject".
Humans are imperfect, finite, mortal creatures. God (and Jesus) are perfect, infinite, and immortal. In order for us to follow God/Jesus, we must reject our imperfections.
Is this not how good people, in general, are morally obligated to act? If our family members fall to falsehoods and lies, we're obligated to stand firm in truth, and to not fall victim to our own family's faults, no matter how much we may love them. This is the correct interpretation of that passage. We're not supposed to fully reject and hate our family, only to prioritize truth (God) above our family. That's the proper order of things, whether you're a Christian or not.
So he tells us to love strangers and enemies, and he tells us to hate and go to war against our family members!
> We're not supposed to fully reject and hate our family, only to prioritize truth (God) above our family.
Yes I understand that this is the point. You're not supposed to hate your family only because they are your family, but you are supposed to put loving God above loving your own family.
And this is *exactly* what I said in my previous post. It breaks down the bonds of blood, because now there is something more important than your own blood; there's a rabbi that you need to love more than your own children.
Note how it doesn't say that you need to love God more than you love your neighbor; Jesus attacks the love for your family and promotes the love for strangers, hence eliminating the special bond that you should have with your kin.
> prioritize truth (God) above our family. That's the proper order of things, whether you're a Christian or not.
This is not the proper order of things. This is the order of things of a psychotic schizophrenic. Abraham heard voices in his head and tried to murder his own son. And you don't think this sounds crazy?
Would you murder your own family if you think you've heard the voice of god commanding you to do so?
If the passage merely "says what it says", it wouldn't be contradicted in other passages of the Bible, or be contradicted by common logic. Thus, the message is not what you're claiming.
Anyway, did you miss the part where I agreed with you?
Yes the passage meaning is that you should put God above your family. This is what I have an issue with.
You said:
> If our family members fall to falsehoods and lies, we're obligated to stand firm in truth, and to not all victim to our own family's faults, no matter how much we may love them. This is the correct interpretation of that passage. We're not supposed to fully reject and hate our family, only to prioritize truth (God) above our family.
Let me ask you something, as a thought experiment.
Imagine you have a 20 years old son who comes home from a night out and he's very upset, crying and scared, and he tells you that he forced himself on a girl. He doesn't know what got into him, but he raped this girl.
Would you:
1) Convince him to turn himself in, and if he doesn't, report him to the authorities.
2) Ask what kind of evidences the girl may have against him, and think about how to provide him with an alibi.